Ravager

"" within an accidental moment
I am seen by chance, ""
there's a repetition here, accidental moment means seen by chance..
a chance is an accident, sio why do you repeat it.
Neverthless; i see a good composition as its purely yours not Ai genrated like so many others here..

"there's a repetition here, accidental moment means seen by chance..
a chance is an accident, sio [SIC]why do you repeat it."

I was looking for an adjective that would modfiy "moment" to suggest that the moment was something that I was not expecting. to happen., but did. Perhaps some other adjective would be more suitable..

"Neverthless; [SIC] I [SIC]see a good composition as its [SIC] purely yours not Ai generated [SIC] like so many others here"

Really?  Which ones are AI-generated?  How can you tell that they are?..

i dont judge you for the vocabulary used, its your own predilection and its good, but, dont you know that Ravager suggests destruction, war, cruelty barbarism and all the saage vocabulary, but you used it for the nostalgic theme tackled here, about aging and losing liveliness and charm....though !!!!  
 
I can easily discern fake from genuine poetry.. and i dare you to write a poem of your own, and one by AiI and i can tell you which is fake and which is yours....Kudos !!!

i dont [SIC] judge you for the vocabulary used, its [SIC ]your own predilection [SIC ,] and its [SIC] good, but, don't [SIC] you know that Ravager suggests destruction, war, cruelty barbarism [sic ,]and all the saage [SIC ]vocabulary, but you used it for the nostalgic theme tackled here, about aging and losing liveliness and charm....though !!!!"

I used it because age has destroyed my looks and therefore is a ravager.  

"I can easily discern fake from genuine poetry.. and I[SIC] dare you to write a poem of your own, and one by AiI and I  [sic]can tell you which is fake and which is yours....Kudos !!!"

If you say so.  Would you care to point to some of the poems posted here that have been AI-generated?

Yes, i can. but due respect must be given to the sick poets o here,  
who seek cathartic relief and healing through poetry..  
some poets here just copy and paste, and i cant show who they are....but i tell you if you write fake or genuine poetry i can see  
the difference easily....  
---  
 
these are some flaws of the Ai poetry.  
 
--reccurent themes and expressions,  and words always repeated...  
---turning about the bush without saying anything concrete or meaningfull.  
 
----you cant see where the theme is heading to.....etc......  
----  
send me a couple of yours and a Ai poem, i tell you..

"Yes, i [SIC] can. [point to examples of AI-generated poetry] but due respect must be given to the sick poets o [SIC] her,who seek cathartic relief and healing through poetry.."

Really?  Why?.  And how is pointing out that a "sick poet's submission is an AI-generated piece disrespectful to t him or her?  

"these are some flaws of the Ai poetry. Â
Â
--reccurent [SIC] themes and expressions, Â and words always repeated... Â
---turning about the bush without saying anything concrete or meaningful. [SIC] Â
Â
----you cant [SIC] see where the theme is heading to.....etc...... Â "

Aren't these also the flaws of people who write their own submissions but have no real poetic talent?

""I asked for two Ai and human creation, you didnt give..""
so its been fun talking with you, regards and farewell.

"""I asked for two Ai and human creation [SIC] you didn't [SIC] give..""
so its [SIC] been fun talking with you, regards and farewell."

And I asked for you to give me examples of pieces submitted to DUP that you already knew were AI-generated, but you kept finding ways to dodge doing so.  

I wonder why?   Could it be that you made a claim that you can't back up?

some poets wrire rhyming abab......or abba.......and so. aabb......rhyming poems; and dont even reply to poets comments;they use Ai...poetry..
you can find them, and there also those who write long proxe stories..

It is not my job to find the poems you claim you already know are AI-generated.

Please give me the titles of at least two submissions to DUP that you know for certain were AI-generated.

Sorry, i cant give you any title, you will surely find out who uses AI.  
generated poems..  
look for poems not replied to, and look liike automatic creation....  
if you are so smart as you think, you can easily find them...  
thank you

"some poets wrire rhyming abab."

You mean like this one?

   https://deepundergroundpoetry.com/poems/532518-winter-glow/

I am now, more than sure why poets dont comment on your weak words, coz simply you are compiicated guy,
Grow up, before you write poetry....

you may not be noticed because you don't use a direct approach love is not so much intellectual but an emotion that sometimes baffles having no reason as far as critique you request it but I haven't really seen you interact with anyone over the years...

What is a "direct approach"?  Can you give me examples of it?

well for instance if you like someone tell them they are unlikely to know otherwise you may send mixed signals...

You have not read my piece carefully.  What the narrator says and is complaining about is that because of what age has done to him he is no longer regarded by women he finds attractive as an object of desire and worth a second look.  In fact, he knows that if he used the direct approach that you suggest he employ, he knows that he'd be regarded as a dirty old man.

that's too bad not to be recognized anymore as someone with passion must hurt...

Hi, Baldwin.

Why have you chosen to set out the poem in two ragged, uneven verses?

Regards.

I'm not sure what you mean by "ragged" or "uneven", let alone that my first two verses are ragged and uneven..

I mean two verses of unequal length with line breaks in all the wrong places.  

Plus, 'comeliness' is entirely the wrong noun when used in relation to a man.  
And Is 'striped' a typo?  

It seems as if you've just scribbled down the poem in two minutes flat and not bothered to read it through again. Consequently, your footnote asking for thoughtful criticism strikes me as a bit rich, to be honest.

Thank you for your remarks.

".  I mean two verses of unequal length with line breaks in all the wrong places. "

But I was unaware, as you also seem to be given the way several of your submissions are set out, that all lines in a poem had to be of the same length or that there were rules regarding where line breaks must occur.  
 Perhaps you will point me to authoritative handbooks on how poetry should be written that show me these things.

In the meantime, you might want to have a look at a poem by award-winning poet Mary Oliver entitled "Fall"   to see that lines of unequal length and peculiar line breaks are unacceptable in poetry.

https://apoemaday.tumblr.com/post/702916361399287808/fall


"Plus, 'comeliness' is entirely the wrong noun when used in relation to a man"."

According to many dictionaries, "comeliness" mess means "the quality of being good-looking or attractive"  

see e.g. https://www.collinsdictionary.com/dictionary/english/comeliness
ee  
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/comely


 So it is not a "wrong word" here.
 
"And Is 'striped' a typo? "

Yes, it should be stripped.  Thanks for pointing this out.  

"..  line breaks[are]  in all the wrong places."

OK.  Where should they have been.?  And what criteria do you use to say that they should have been elsewhere?

 
       
Hi again, Baldwin.  
 
Two points:  
 
First, I have never seen the word 'comely' used in relation to a man. My 'New Oxford Dictionary of English' gives:  
 
 'pleasant to look at; attractive  
(typically used of a woman).  
the comely Italian actress Valeria Golino'.                
 
Secondly, with regard to line/verse length and line breaks, of course I'm aware that lines can be of unequal length, and that in non-formal verse there are no 'rules' determining where line-breaks should occur. Generally, however, there are sound reasons why in non-formal verse poets break their lines where they do, or have verses of unequal length. Your poem appears to lack, to me at least, any reason for both its  inappropriate line-breaks or verse length. But see my comments  below.                    
 
 
I think your poem falls naturally into three quatrains of a largely iambic metre. I'll go through it line by line.  
 
The first four words of your poem is a nice iambic tetrameter:  
 
I’ve now become invisible  
 
I would put the line-break after 'invisible'. A reader will read the line and think, 'What?' Their eye will naturally read on to the second line and they'll realise why the narrator has become invisible. Then they'll be into the poem. Breaking the line after 'become' spoils this effect. Also, placing the word ''invisibe' on a line by itself makes the word very visible indeed, which goes against the sense of the word and makes for bad poetry. The rest of that verse is fine, I would say.  
 
Moving on to the second verse, the first commenter on the poem has already pointed out the tautology – 'accidental' 'chance' – in the first two lines, so one of those words has to go. I'd amend the wording slightly, remove the nonsensical line-break after 'if', cut 'accidental' and set out the lines as:                
 
And if at any moment                      
I am seen by chance,  
 
To keep to the three-quatrain layout, I'd end the verse after 'glance' seting out its last two lines as:  
 
I’m easily discounted                      
as a man not worth a second glance.                      
 
For the third and final verse  
 
Age the ravager,                      
age the savager  
 
is fine.  In the final two lines 'comeliness', as I've said, is a word usually associated with a woman not a man. I'd find a more apposite word to replace it, if I were you. (See below for lay-out.)  
 
To recap and conclude, I'd set out the poem like this:  
 
Ravager  
 
I’ve now become invisible  
to women I desire.                      
I’m easily ignored.                      
and overlooked;  
 
and if at any moment                      
I am seen by chance,                      
I’m easily discounted                      
as a man not worth a second glance.                  
 
Age the ravager,                      
age the savager                      
has stripped my flesh                      
of any [ ... ] or kindling fire.  
 
 
You'd have to fill in the blank in the fourth line of the final verse.  
 
All that's just my poor opinion, though, so if you think it's a load of balls just say so. 🙃                      
 
Best wishes.  
 

""I have never seen the word 'comely' used in relation to a man. My 'New Oxford Dictionary of English' gives: 'pleasant to look at; attractive (typically used of a woman).  the comely Italian actress Valeria Golino'"

This is a fine example of the fallacy known as the appeal to personal incredulity"  -- "I have never seen X, applied to Y; therefore it is wrong to apply X to Y.

In any case, the word I question is "comliness" not "comely.

I'll take your other comments into consideration.  But I note that you did nor fulfill my request to point me to  any authoritative handbook o writing poetry that comfirs your claims about when and where line breaks are inappropriate..


.  

'Comely' or 'comeliness', adjective or noun, generally refers to women in the same way as 'pretty' or 'prettiness' does.. Look in any paper dictionary for confirmation. However, it's your poem, so stick with the inappropriate use of 'comeliness' if you wish..Perhaps my New Oxford Dictionary of English is in error.

The reason I didn't refer you to any authoritative handbook on line-breaks in non-formal verse is quite simply because there isn't one. I did say however that the poet writing non-formal verse will have good reasons for choosing to place his or her line-breaks where he or she does, reasons which will be readily apparent to the reader of the poem. In your poem, I could see no reason at all for breaking the line after 'and if' in the first line of the second verse, for example.  Rather, in my opinion, it f*cks up the line by interrupting the flow of the iambic metre. Again, however, it's your poem and it's up to you. Your readers will decide, as I did, if it's bollocks or not. (It is.)

One thing I will say decidedly, though, is that in your poem as it currently stands the tautology in the second and third lines of the second verse makes you appear to be a bit thick. That two commenters  have now remarked on this error yet still you have neglected to emend it makes you appear to be not only a bit thick but also ignorant as well.

Anyway, that's enough from me. I enjoy discussions of this nature.

Best wishes.

"'Comely' or 'comeliness', adjective or noun, generally refers to women in the same way as 'pretty' or 'prettiness' does"  
 
Please note that this does not say that the words "comply" or the adjective comliness is never applied to a man. .  
 
Moreover, there are examples of it being so  
 
"He is comely" is a phrase that appears in the Bible, and it means that someone is handsome or beautiful. It can also mean that something is suitable or befitting for the righteous.  
Examples in the Bible  
1 Samuel 16:18: Describes a man as "comely in his person, beautiful, handsome in his person  
 
"Hence they grow old beardless and their young men are without comeliness, because a face furrowed by the sword spoils by its scars the natural beauty of a beard.  (open, save, copy)"  
 
 
He was an ugly boy, though admittedly more comely than a certain dwarf with half a nose and a scar from eye to chin.  
From NPR  
 
And when he showed himself to the Princess, she found him as comely a youth as she had ever seen.  
Robin Hobb THE GOLDEN FOOL: BOOK TWO OF THE TAWNY MAN (2001)  
AI Overview
Learn more
Can Men Be Called Beautiful?. I used to think it was just ...
Yes, the word "comely" can be used to describe a man. "Comely" is an adjective that means attractive or pleasing in appearance. For example, you might describe a man as "comely" if he has a comely face or is a comely youth.  
Explanation  
"Comely" is an adjective that means attractive or pleasing in appearance.
It can be used to describe a man's appearance.
Synonyms of "comely" include "beautiful," "handsome," "pretty," and "fair".
"Comely" can also mean proper, seemly, or becoming.

"Comely" can be used in a literary or old-fashioned way.
sca_esv=aa4709d8f74669be&q=Can+comely+be+used+for+a+man&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjTzoXe4rmLAxW7AzQIHdPXDvk4ChDVAnoECCEQAQ&biw=1366&bih=641&dpr=1

All of which would be fine if the rest of the language used in your poem were of an 'old-fashioned' or 'literary' kind. However, it's not. Your poem's written in modern English, which makes your use of 'comeliness' appear anachronistic, to say the least. If you like it, though, keep it. As I said, it's your poem.  

Best wishes  

My dear Baldy
Your author's note amounts to poor judgment and is likely to alienate any readers you might attract.
I suspect you may not realise it but the exchanges you generate in the comments on your poems often prove more entertaining than the poems themselves.
If you wish to excel as a poet my advice is to channel all your energy into what you write rather than squander it on pretentious nitpicking
There are many compensations that come with age, btw. Tolerance of conflicting opinions is just one.
Best regards~ Abra

"Your author's note amounts to poor judgment ".

Please do me the kindness of telling me how my note on what I'd like to receive from those who wish to respond to my submissions  is something that amounts to "poor judgement" on my part?

Let us not pussyfoot around the real issue here --which is not whether you consider your author's note is likely to encourage the reader to respond as you would wish.
Put simply, you are more than capable of creating poems that entertain without adopting a hair shirt mentality when responding to feedback.
I'll refrain from any further discussion, B as I am currently time poor with important work to attend to.
(Nuke typo in L1 of author's note)

"Let us not pussyfoot around the real issue here --which is not whether you consider your author's note is likely to encourage the reader to respond as you would wish."    

Assuming that this IS the real issue, my answer is "No, I don't consider my note as something likely to " encourage" readers of my submissions to respond to them in any way. It is nothing more than a statement about what I consider  "criticism (critique) entails. I trust that I am allowed to state this.  
 
What is it you are hoping to receive when you note as you do that you would like to have "honest criticism" of your submissions?  
..

^That's an easy one word answer ^ "Truth" --always bearing in mind that the reader's perception may differ from the writer's intention.
But also consider there are no rules for this type of poetry, no nailed on devices guaranteed to improve your work. It's simply best to rely on gut feeling. Your own judgment is what matters most.
I never stop editing, none of my poems are ever finished. Reading aloud helps me decide where line breaks should go. I prefer (not always) to ditch formal punctuation as (in this case) the line breaks are doing the work although I agree with Ajay they look ragged. The punctuation you've used also appears random, a tad slipshod.
The subject of the poem is an interesting one however and deserves better but for me it resembles prose more than poetry. I'd suggest you beef up some verbs and address the all important matter of details. When did the penny drop you'd become invisible -- a water cooler moment perhaps? Who was the object of your desire -- was the snub obvious or more subtle? When did the devil first attack? (Tx JB)
Enough now. Put your energy into your poem not commenting.

Thank you for your comments.

I'm just interested to know how you distinguish full stops from enjambment. uish how your lack of punctuation serves what it is that you are trying to convert to a reader.  Surely the unpunctuated phrase "eats little diarrhea" is likely to be read as saying something quite different from "eats little, diarrhea".