Coronavirus ( Covid-19) Part II
Having said that, im gathering fact filled clips and going FULL poetry on them...
NO BULL
only human and pet shit. 🐱💩🐶💩👱🏻♀️💩
NO BULL
only human and pet shit. 🐱💩🐶💩👱🏻♀️💩
Ahavati said:
The term you used, "numbers being very skewed", ( [ extremely ] "biased or distorted in a way that is regarded as inaccurate, unfair, or misleading" ) would lead the reader to believe that the Dark Horse Podcasts were asserting that numbers were intentionally skewed vs low quality, which infers poor or inferior vs deliberate.
Glad we cleared that up! Have fun with your day!
Thanks for flushing that with reality. 🚽💙
The term you used, "numbers being very skewed", ( [ extremely ] "biased or distorted in a way that is regarded as inaccurate, unfair, or misleading" ) would lead the reader to believe that the Dark Horse Podcasts were asserting that numbers were intentionally skewed vs low quality, which infers poor or inferior vs deliberate.
Glad we cleared that up! Have fun with your day!
Thanks for flushing that with reality. 🚽💙
Josh said:
I'm sure you're with me when I say we see the world as we are, rather than 'as it is' - we all have our cognitive biases, which hard-wire over time and become more fixed as one gets older - bringing the challenge as to how best to maintain an open mind in the light of many years experience of life and politics.
Yep! It's one of my favorite quote by Anais Nin.
That said, my personal bias is to look at the situation through the eyes of political history, as also informed by family history of involvement in wars -- rather than through the lens of just medicine. To me, there are a number of severe warning-signs of authoritarian take-over whilst everyone's busy with Covid, and that is what concerns me most.
I can understand that to a certain degree ( the historical lens ). However, taking note of your previous comments elsewhere in regards to US history: yes; Bush lied about WMD's, and the other incidents you mentioned were true; however, where is our draconian measures? Nothing changed for the American people ( as far as I know ) despite screams of 'conspiracy' to take our rights away.
If nothing else, harassment and bullying of middle-eastern individuals increased, just as those against Asians has increased now. This is one of the reasons conspiracy theorists are labeled the way they are. It's like seeing the guy with the sign "Jesus is coming soon", Christians know it's probably true; however, they just don't know when.
The bit I've highlighted in the 'quote' above is indeed key - and the answer might in the end be 'both'.
My concern is also that questioning voices are too easily labelled 'conspiracy theory', (as indeed mainstream media may too easily be labelled 'ALL gov't propaganda'). The BBC at least should be giving more time to questioning voices, and to proposals that locking down and supporting the most vulnerable would make more sense than locking down entire economies, and trashing millions of lively-hoods.
I am questioning those voices from history too. Have you lived in America? Have you ever been a citizen? What rights have we lost as individuals due to history, that weren't geared for our protection as a whole, i.e. - we must wear seatbelts, helmets, etc. If I am missing something enlighten me so I can understand your point, because you keep using America as examples of fudged history.
Believe me; I am not attacking you; nor do I feel defensive in the least. I simply want to understand where you are coming from, particularly in reference to America's history.
I'm not sure if I've seen the same Dark Horse podcasts yet so will have to check them out before saying any more.
You will enjoy their efforts to be open and honest with the information they put forth, including beginning with business first, then any corrections to their previous podcasts.
Sorry I didn't inform you of my reply to your lengthy reply on the original Covid thread - I had seen your comments at the beginning of the new "Corona Time" thread and assumed (incorrectly) you were following it.
Right; when my thread was locked due to size, I lost heart, being there were threads much bigger. I stepped away from it all to gain perspective ( or swallow that pill, per se ); I was completely clueless you had responded, and honestly thought Carpe was referring to the last comment you made on the previous thread.
It's all good now. As my grandmother used to say, "It all comes out in the wash, if'n you do it right."
I'm sure you're with me when I say we see the world as we are, rather than 'as it is' - we all have our cognitive biases, which hard-wire over time and become more fixed as one gets older - bringing the challenge as to how best to maintain an open mind in the light of many years experience of life and politics.
Yep! It's one of my favorite quote by Anais Nin.
That said, my personal bias is to look at the situation through the eyes of political history, as also informed by family history of involvement in wars -- rather than through the lens of just medicine. To me, there are a number of severe warning-signs of authoritarian take-over whilst everyone's busy with Covid, and that is what concerns me most.
I can understand that to a certain degree ( the historical lens ). However, taking note of your previous comments elsewhere in regards to US history: yes; Bush lied about WMD's, and the other incidents you mentioned were true; however, where is our draconian measures? Nothing changed for the American people ( as far as I know ) despite screams of 'conspiracy' to take our rights away.
If nothing else, harassment and bullying of middle-eastern individuals increased, just as those against Asians has increased now. This is one of the reasons conspiracy theorists are labeled the way they are. It's like seeing the guy with the sign "Jesus is coming soon", Christians know it's probably true; however, they just don't know when.
The bit I've highlighted in the 'quote' above is indeed key - and the answer might in the end be 'both'.
My concern is also that questioning voices are too easily labelled 'conspiracy theory', (as indeed mainstream media may too easily be labelled 'ALL gov't propaganda'). The BBC at least should be giving more time to questioning voices, and to proposals that locking down and supporting the most vulnerable would make more sense than locking down entire economies, and trashing millions of lively-hoods.
I am questioning those voices from history too. Have you lived in America? Have you ever been a citizen? What rights have we lost as individuals due to history, that weren't geared for our protection as a whole, i.e. - we must wear seatbelts, helmets, etc. If I am missing something enlighten me so I can understand your point, because you keep using America as examples of fudged history.
Believe me; I am not attacking you; nor do I feel defensive in the least. I simply want to understand where you are coming from, particularly in reference to America's history.
I'm not sure if I've seen the same Dark Horse podcasts yet so will have to check them out before saying any more.
You will enjoy their efforts to be open and honest with the information they put forth, including beginning with business first, then any corrections to their previous podcasts.
Sorry I didn't inform you of my reply to your lengthy reply on the original Covid thread - I had seen your comments at the beginning of the new "Corona Time" thread and assumed (incorrectly) you were following it.
Right; when my thread was locked due to size, I lost heart, being there were threads much bigger. I stepped away from it all to gain perspective ( or swallow that pill, per se ); I was completely clueless you had responded, and honestly thought Carpe was referring to the last comment you made on the previous thread.
It's all good now. As my grandmother used to say, "It all comes out in the wash, if'n you do it right."
Ahavati said:
Right; when my thread was locked due to size, I lost heart, being there were threads much bigger. I stepped away from it all to gain perspective ( or swallow that pill, per se ); I was completely clueless you had responded, and honestly thought Carpe was referring to the last comment you made on the previous thread.
It's all good now. As my grandmother used to say, "It all comes out in the wash, if'n you do it right."
Hullo
have been away for a bit. just wanted to say I locked the thread. p'raps there are bigger threads, I dunno. quite honest, I figured a new thread would be imminent. didn't see a problem or potential offence, or loss of heart
didn't have a problem with the thread. participated a fair bit. don't take it to heart, it wasn't personal
thank you muchly
Right; when my thread was locked due to size, I lost heart, being there were threads much bigger. I stepped away from it all to gain perspective ( or swallow that pill, per se ); I was completely clueless you had responded, and honestly thought Carpe was referring to the last comment you made on the previous thread.
It's all good now. As my grandmother used to say, "It all comes out in the wash, if'n you do it right."
Hullo
have been away for a bit. just wanted to say I locked the thread. p'raps there are bigger threads, I dunno. quite honest, I figured a new thread would be imminent. didn't see a problem or potential offence, or loss of heart
didn't have a problem with the thread. participated a fair bit. don't take it to heart, it wasn't personal
thank you muchly
Ahavati said:
Right; when my thread was locked due to size, I lost heart, being there were threads much bigger. I stepped away from it all to gain perspective ( or swallow that pill, per se ); I was completely clueless you had responded, and honestly thought Carpe was referring to the last comment you made on the previous thread.
It's all good now. As my grandmother used to say, "It all comes out in the wash, if'n you do it right."
I'm so sorry for wasting your post space on the other thread...
NOW I really get how it bites. We all babbled on and on...
😔
...a bit like I'm doing now.... but worse
😯 (Still working on it!!)😫
Right; when my thread was locked due to size, I lost heart, being there were threads much bigger. I stepped away from it all to gain perspective ( or swallow that pill, per se ); I was completely clueless you had responded, and honestly thought Carpe was referring to the last comment you made on the previous thread.
It's all good now. As my grandmother used to say, "It all comes out in the wash, if'n you do it right."
I'm so sorry for wasting your post space on the other thread...
NOW I really get how it bites. We all babbled on and on...
😔
...a bit like I'm doing now.... but worse
😯 (Still working on it!!)😫
lepperochan said:
Hullo
have been away for a bit. just wanted to say I locked the thread. p'raps there are bigger threads, I dunno. quite honest, I figured a new thread would be imminent. didn't see a problem or potential offence, or loss of heart
didn't have a problem with the thread. participated a fair bit. don't take it to heart, it wasn't personal
thank you muchly
Thank you.
EdibleWords said:
I'm so sorry for wasting your post space on the other thread...
NOW I really get how it bites. We all babbled on and on...
😔
...a bit like I'm doing now.... but worse
😯 (Still working on it!!)😫
Thank you.
Hullo
have been away for a bit. just wanted to say I locked the thread. p'raps there are bigger threads, I dunno. quite honest, I figured a new thread would be imminent. didn't see a problem or potential offence, or loss of heart
didn't have a problem with the thread. participated a fair bit. don't take it to heart, it wasn't personal
thank you muchly
Thank you.
EdibleWords said:
I'm so sorry for wasting your post space on the other thread...
NOW I really get how it bites. We all babbled on and on...
😔
...a bit like I'm doing now.... but worse
😯 (Still working on it!!)😫
Thank you.
rut row
The New York Times Just Published Documents Showing Trump’s COVID-19 Response Was Worse Than We Knew
This story is nuts. You really should read it. If you don’t believe me, it has six bylines by some of its most famous reporters on it. Six.
https://www.motherjones.com/coronavirus-updates/2020/04/trump-coronavirus-response-new-york-times/
FACT:
Mother Jones was founded as a nonprofit in 1976 because we knew corporations and the wealthy wouldn't fund the type of hard-hitting journalism we set out to do.
Today, reader support makes up about two-thirds of our budget, allows us to dig deep on stories that matter, and lets us keep our reporting free for everyone. If you value what you get from Mother Jones, please join us with a tax-deductible donation today so we can keep on doing the type of journalism 2020 demands.
The New York Times Just Published Documents Showing Trump’s COVID-19 Response Was Worse Than We Knew
This story is nuts. You really should read it. If you don’t believe me, it has six bylines by some of its most famous reporters on it. Six.
https://www.motherjones.com/coronavirus-updates/2020/04/trump-coronavirus-response-new-york-times/
FACT:
Mother Jones was founded as a nonprofit in 1976 because we knew corporations and the wealthy wouldn't fund the type of hard-hitting journalism we set out to do.
Today, reader support makes up about two-thirds of our budget, allows us to dig deep on stories that matter, and lets us keep our reporting free for everyone. If you value what you get from Mother Jones, please join us with a tax-deductible donation today so we can keep on doing the type of journalism 2020 demands.
Happy Easter!
“God Will Shield Us”: Some Churches Expect Crowds For Easter
[ . . . ]
Ammon Bundy, a rancher who led an armed occupation of an Oregon federal wildlife refuge in 2016, also told CNN he plans to gather several hundred people at an undisclosed location in Idaho, saying he’s unconcerned if he catches or spreads the virus. “Our goal is to get enough people together and secure our rights….We are not trying to provoke, we want people to be able to worship,” Bundy said.
https://www.motherjones.com/coronavirus-updates/2020/04/easter-coronavirus-church-crowds/
“God Will Shield Us”: Some Churches Expect Crowds For Easter
[ . . . ]
Ammon Bundy, a rancher who led an armed occupation of an Oregon federal wildlife refuge in 2016, also told CNN he plans to gather several hundred people at an undisclosed location in Idaho, saying he’s unconcerned if he catches or spreads the virus. “Our goal is to get enough people together and secure our rights….We are not trying to provoke, we want people to be able to worship,” Bundy said.
https://www.motherjones.com/coronavirus-updates/2020/04/easter-coronavirus-church-crowds/
How about some good news!
https://www.fox13news.com/video/672737
PS.... my vid above comes with fact links.... I should have said that... they are on youtube.
https://www.fox13news.com/video/672737
PS.... my vid above comes with fact links.... I should have said that... they are on youtube.
From The WHO's Situation Report as of 11,
Apr. 2020:
SITUATION IN NUMBERS total (new cases in last 24 hours)
Globally 1 610 909 confirmed (89 657)
99 690 deaths (6892)
European Region 839 257 confirmed (39 561)
70 565 deaths (4352)
Region of the Americas 536 664 confirmed (43 491)
19 294 deaths (2256)
Western Pacific Region 118 549 confirmed (1302)
4017 deaths (39)
Eastern Mediterranean Region 92 226 confirmed (3569)
4771 deaths (164)
South-East Asia Region 14 161 confirmed (1183)
617 deaths (48)
African Region 9340 confirmed (551)
415 deaths (33)
https://www.who.int/emergencies/diseases/novel-coronavirus-2019/situation-reports
Apr. 2020:
SITUATION IN NUMBERS total (new cases in last 24 hours)
Globally 1 610 909 confirmed (89 657)
99 690 deaths (6892)
European Region 839 257 confirmed (39 561)
70 565 deaths (4352)
Region of the Americas 536 664 confirmed (43 491)
19 294 deaths (2256)
Western Pacific Region 118 549 confirmed (1302)
4017 deaths (39)
Eastern Mediterranean Region 92 226 confirmed (3569)
4771 deaths (164)
South-East Asia Region 14 161 confirmed (1183)
617 deaths (48)
African Region 9340 confirmed (551)
415 deaths (33)
https://www.who.int/emergencies/diseases/novel-coronavirus-2019/situation-reports
This is a fantastic article regarding the reduction in numbers.
[ . . . ]
The Best-Case Scenario for Coronavirus Is That It’s Way More Infectious Than We Think
By David Wallace-Wells
But also over the past few days, the number of new hospitalizations in New York has probably begun to flatten. San Francisco has started to think about what follows shelter in place. And, in perhaps the most significant development, revisions to the pandemic model developed by the Institute for Health Metrics and Evaluation (IHME) at the University of Washington suggested that the country would ultimately need fewer beds, fewer ICU beds, fewer ventilators and doctors and nurses and PPE — in short, fewer hospital resources of all kinds than was expected. More strikingly, it revised its most recent estimates for the ultimate coronavirus death toll downward by 11,765, or roughly 15 percent: from 93,531 to 81,766. A couple of days later, it revised them even more dramatically, from 81,766 to 60,415, or roughly 25 percent more.
[ . . . ]
These revisions may be eye-opening, in addition to being encouraging, because as recently as a week or two ago, the projections discussed by most public-health officials were much, much higher. When Donald Trump unveiled his “flatten the curve” chart, months after public-health experts began advocating that approach to the disease, he was working off the IMHE model, and suggesting that between 100,000 and 240,000 Americans would die. A model developed by the CDC projected a range between 200,000 and 1.7 million. The Imperial College model famously predicted 2.2 million deaths in the U.S. in a do-nothing scenario, and more than 1 million even if quite aggressive mitigation measures were adopted. As of April 2, a survey of public-health officials summarized by FiveThirtyEight found a median projection of around 263,000 deaths. The new IHME model suggests an ultimate toll less than one-quarter that number, about one-20th the figure projected in the Imperial College’s “mitigation” scenario, and less than one-30th what was projected in their “do nothing” scenario.
[ . . . ]
https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2020/04/best-case-scenario-for-coronavirus.html
This is a really good breakdown/tracking map regarding each US state.
https://www.cnn.com/interactive/2020/health/coronavirus-us-maps-and-cases/
[ . . . ]
The Best-Case Scenario for Coronavirus Is That It’s Way More Infectious Than We Think
By David Wallace-Wells
But also over the past few days, the number of new hospitalizations in New York has probably begun to flatten. San Francisco has started to think about what follows shelter in place. And, in perhaps the most significant development, revisions to the pandemic model developed by the Institute for Health Metrics and Evaluation (IHME) at the University of Washington suggested that the country would ultimately need fewer beds, fewer ICU beds, fewer ventilators and doctors and nurses and PPE — in short, fewer hospital resources of all kinds than was expected. More strikingly, it revised its most recent estimates for the ultimate coronavirus death toll downward by 11,765, or roughly 15 percent: from 93,531 to 81,766. A couple of days later, it revised them even more dramatically, from 81,766 to 60,415, or roughly 25 percent more.
[ . . . ]
These revisions may be eye-opening, in addition to being encouraging, because as recently as a week or two ago, the projections discussed by most public-health officials were much, much higher. When Donald Trump unveiled his “flatten the curve” chart, months after public-health experts began advocating that approach to the disease, he was working off the IMHE model, and suggesting that between 100,000 and 240,000 Americans would die. A model developed by the CDC projected a range between 200,000 and 1.7 million. The Imperial College model famously predicted 2.2 million deaths in the U.S. in a do-nothing scenario, and more than 1 million even if quite aggressive mitigation measures were adopted. As of April 2, a survey of public-health officials summarized by FiveThirtyEight found a median projection of around 263,000 deaths. The new IHME model suggests an ultimate toll less than one-quarter that number, about one-20th the figure projected in the Imperial College’s “mitigation” scenario, and less than one-30th what was projected in their “do nothing” scenario.
[ . . . ]
https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2020/04/best-case-scenario-for-coronavirus.html
This is a really good breakdown/tracking map regarding each US state.
https://www.cnn.com/interactive/2020/health/coronavirus-us-maps-and-cases/
hemihead said:Amazing isn’t it...the infection rate seems staggeringly high....”virulent” is almost a poor descriptor. The good news being that every person that has it brings the mortality rate down....
Yup; almost seems a contradiction. "The dog was so ugly he was cute, and thus won the 'Most Beautiful Dog Show.'"
I'm still tracking whether ( or not ) it's airborne. Here's an interesting study from scientists in Finland.
Model suggests how airborne coronavirus particles spread in grocery store aisles
[ . . . ]
The researchers modelled the movement of aerosol particles smaller than 20 micrometers, which include particles small enough to remain suspended in the air (rather than falling to the floor) or move along air currents.
The researchers will continue to refine their modeling and develop visualizations to help better understand the movement of airborne particles.
I think at this point anyone going out ( to public places such as stores ) without a mask is putting themselves ( and others ) at risk.
Yup; almost seems a contradiction. "The dog was so ugly he was cute, and thus won the 'Most Beautiful Dog Show.'"
I'm still tracking whether ( or not ) it's airborne. Here's an interesting study from scientists in Finland.
Model suggests how airborne coronavirus particles spread in grocery store aisles
[ . . . ]
The researchers modelled the movement of aerosol particles smaller than 20 micrometers, which include particles small enough to remain suspended in the air (rather than falling to the floor) or move along air currents.
The researchers will continue to refine their modeling and develop visualizations to help better understand the movement of airborne particles.
I think at this point anyone going out ( to public places such as stores ) without a mask is putting themselves ( and others ) at risk.
Here is a more recent podcast ( by a day ). It's only about 5 minutes or so.
Does coronavirus spread through the air
On this week’s show, Staff Writer Robert Service talks with host Sarah Crespi about a new National Academy of Sciences report that suggests the novel coronavirus can go airborne, the evidence for this idea, and what this means for the mask-wearing debate.
https://www.sciencemag.org/podcast/does-coronavirus-spread-through-air-and-biology-anorexia
It was opened up by referencing he debated this issue, so I searched for that actual debate and found this article he'd written:
You may be able to spread coronavirus just by breathing, new report finds
Science’s COVID-19 reporting is supported by the Pulitzer Center.
The National Academy of Sciences (NAS) has given a boost to an unsettling idea: that the novel coronavirus can spread through the air—not just through the large droplets emitted in a cough or sneeze. Though current studies aren’t conclusive, “the results of available studies are consistent with aerosolization of virus from normal breathing,” Harvey Fineberg, who heads a standing committee on Emerging Infectious Diseases and 21st Century Health Threats, wrote in a 1 April letter to Kelvin Droegemeier, head of the White House Office of Science and Technology Policy.
https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2020/04/you-may-be-able-spread-coronavirus-just-breathing-new-report-finds
Does coronavirus spread through the air
On this week’s show, Staff Writer Robert Service talks with host Sarah Crespi about a new National Academy of Sciences report that suggests the novel coronavirus can go airborne, the evidence for this idea, and what this means for the mask-wearing debate.
https://www.sciencemag.org/podcast/does-coronavirus-spread-through-air-and-biology-anorexia
It was opened up by referencing he debated this issue, so I searched for that actual debate and found this article he'd written:
You may be able to spread coronavirus just by breathing, new report finds
Science’s COVID-19 reporting is supported by the Pulitzer Center.
The National Academy of Sciences (NAS) has given a boost to an unsettling idea: that the novel coronavirus can spread through the air—not just through the large droplets emitted in a cough or sneeze. Though current studies aren’t conclusive, “the results of available studies are consistent with aerosolization of virus from normal breathing,” Harvey Fineberg, who heads a standing committee on Emerging Infectious Diseases and 21st Century Health Threats, wrote in a 1 April letter to Kelvin Droegemeier, head of the White House Office of Science and Technology Policy.
https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2020/04/you-may-be-able-spread-coronavirus-just-breathing-new-report-finds
Yes. Interesting has this has changed somewhat. I think, regardless, face masks to limit both transmission and inhalation (accepting there are other cavities that are vulnerable) seems like a straight forward control.
My own models on death rates have continually needed adjustment in relation to the total US numbers, as well as here in NZ, yet the total infection rate has been the other way. So, excluding all the obvious reporting and testing issues, it is clearly more virulent but less fatal....and 10 days after lockdown the numbers always start to change steadily and surely.
Would be interesting maths if it wasn’t discussing death and lives undoing.
My own models on death rates have continually needed adjustment in relation to the total US numbers, as well as here in NZ, yet the total infection rate has been the other way. So, excluding all the obvious reporting and testing issues, it is clearly more virulent but less fatal....and 10 days after lockdown the numbers always start to change steadily and surely.
Would be interesting maths if it wasn’t discussing death and lives undoing.
