got words

Even if you get a dog-words will still wake  you as your dog sleeps

Then I can just blame it on the dog.  You write the poems next you dog. You're talking in your sleep.

That's true catlady, but a dog will wake because you are awake and comfort you and your soul

and not run around the yard howling when I call... and causing me problems with my neighbors the way words do.

did you jump off the train for a minute there?
something i tried to do recently.

No, I just bitched and whined until the train backed all ofthe way up for me.

but then you would have left a lot of people disappointed... that doesn't seem like the case here.

fuck it, if you ain't got a concrete idea then give us the water and limestone. I would like to see you write more, and I am glad to see how this exercise became a write. My sense of your personality comes more from thoughtful comments that you leave on poems and in threads than on your poems. Ehhh long way of just saying that I would like to see more.

This one.
yeah, i'll totally buy the dog/word thing. Well laid, I think we all get it, and it's not quite a humorous take on that writerly angst (in how I read it), but it approaches that. Enjoy the voice of that. The blister fuck opener is a great line, and that stanza works for me, but something in that last line gives me a small hesitation when reading through. Maybe just too many words on one line, and I keep wanting to read it "...altogether when smoothing...". I would maybe consider starting a new line after "altogether" too...that is a small nit, that I am picking more in the spirit of creative dialogue.

"I got people to watch my words    
try to figure what the fuck ails them"

I get confused a little by whether its the 'words' or the 'people' that ail. I enjoy the pace and sounds of the following lines, but lose track. I am prob reading it wrong. The end wraps honest enough, I think we are all allowed some "I did this because I did this" lines occasionally

Thanks man. The what ails them spot is easy enough to fix. One word. Thanks for the catch. I'll smooth that smoothing before I step out for the day. Wish I could write more, but like the poem says that are just contrived and clumsy as fuck lately. I'd pared it down to reading you, DanX, hemi and Alptraum for quite a while. Just too much to do more. With one of you down I branched out and I read some of anna and jonrot. It just made it clear to me how fucking labored and contrived my shit has been. I'm going to look in a new direction if I can see down that way. Maybe it won't work, but I can't write like I did before. If poems come, they come, if not I ain't going to cry.

Dig the smooth revision

I kind of get it, I think.

Love this line "mongrels loose upon the field like wildflower"

and this stanza.

"and I'm that sot who pulls up the flowers for his lady                
comes in to find they're all goldenrod                
rough and mostly gone to seed                
and well maybe she barely knows me                
so this is awkward                
a bit creepy"

Like an emptying of thought that may somehow make things clearer.

Enjoyed this piece Steve. It is different and that is good I believe.  Nice one.

Thank you. Different is what I'm after. I was trying to write a poem about serenity. Thinking that I can't even let my words lie there in peace. Had a few lines about that. I just keep unhappily shuffling them. Almost home last night and I was coming into an intersection a bit rough with revving engine and fog lights. Guy walking his dog. The dog didn't look up at me, not worried, calmly trusted his master that I was no threat. That dog had serenity and trust. I'm coming home to words that I don't like, don't like me. Depressed and I'm reading other poets. They don't seem to have such a wresting match to put down a few fresh objects and some honest emotion. Certainly doesn't take them a month to write each one. Well that's what I'm trying to fix. Make it simple and direct, don't fight with it. Maybe I think I won't come back and hate it. Maybe let it be. Still not doing too well. Twenty four edits since I posted this one.

It's always good to evolve in our writing, as in style, form, genre, grammar etc but you should never change the essence of you, which is the main ingredient in writing. That is the part which shouldn't be forced, should just come naturally.

Like the way you take your photographs.  They capture so much.

It will always be me, no way around it. Old process I still read other people, still aspired, but never felt natural. New process... honestly it is right back to the old. I'm way past fifty passes of changing a few lines or few words. Is it starting to look spontaneous now? Another hundred stabs and I figure I will have carved this hamburger into a fresh orchid dripping with morning dew

"Another hundred stabs and I figure I will have carved this hamburger into a fresh orchid dripping with morning dew"

Now that is poetic.

what's in a word....limestone?lemon-aid?
wee
all's here sittin in our cells yammerin worser than
typhoon robber barons of 'Industrie de la Poésie'.

what am I talkin about?...NO THING....just wanted to make a mark on the rare Bragg poompost----
yknow, -fcknKilroyWasHere- I wish I could Stop writing/Stop voluminously posting the shit at that. no can do. I spray my clumsy-as-fuck all over...'should be ashamed of myself' Ha!

it's only disawareness of Our Own contrivance that maketh contrivance the essence of egoshit on the poopoo platter

Danno always a pleasure have you come and babble under my poems. They are rare, but sure as shit nobody would want to read what came out if I didn't delete 90 plus percent of my little half paragraphs. I have made up my mind that I should learn how to write soon. I have been reading some folks doing stuff that on the surface is straight and uncomplicated, but when I try to pick at it there are no cracks or seams, just hard objects glued together with honest statements. I want to try to do that. Got to un-complicate the way this has been going.

maybe try writing short spontaneo'etudes.
('automatic' writing 'exercises'?),
whereby
ye deny yrself the option of any tweeking, & after a day or two, if it still irks ye t'read wha'ye rote, then delete it totally rather than tinker (obcess) over it......see wha'appens, yknow.

also, maybelike try writing wit'out any 'self' references (also in the spirit of 'etude'). ye know, like no personal/possessive pronouns...
all human writing is ultimately about the 'self' who's writing it, whether poo'try or the 'directions' on a box'o Rice-a-Roni....

it's like developing a sense of what Not to write (witout Thinking about it), so's maybe perhaps possibly 'free' oneself from compulsive re-riting...

or not.....I used to think I Knew about this shit, butt, blessed be, I don'know shit'bout any thththing

fuckidunno

Thank you much. I will put some though and effort into your suggestions. I also see what you mean about the I in it. Deliberately tried to leave it out of my last one, but here it is everywhere even when I don't don't write it down.

I like the idea of this Steve, I think if you commit yourself to either the minimal or the longer, then the poem will be stronger. I don't see terrible things happening if you use a couple of commas. I think the first line could use one after 'words. I'd probably shorten should have to should've.

The first two lines don't read right to me, but it's not the words, I think if you broke the second line at night, then merged the rest of that line with the one under it, that would do the trick.

It's a charmer of a poem, and like LB said,.good to see you writing more, honing in on a niche

shine on, Steve

Look at all of you guys writing whole big long paragraphs with specific suggestions. My heart is going pitter patter. Good suggestions Eamon. I put the contraction in the first line. I did not however go with the commas. If I'm going to strip the commas and caps I'm going to do them all (except the I). I'll havebto use line breaks. So the first line became two. The second got reworded. Thanks for taking the time.

Imagine standing in a field. You look out on one view. You then turn slightly, in increments, seeing your view change bit by bit until you return to the original. I have little issue with each metaphor you have here. I found damn near all of them quite competent and well said actually. The problem for me is connecting the dots to your over all view (particularly the original view)

That is where it is missing the beat for me.

"Another way to think of extended metaphors is in terms of implications of a base metaphor"

Your base metaphor, for me is the dog. What are the implications in your other metaphors to your dog? See where I am going with this?

Enjoyed reading this Mr. Bragg.

Yeah I get what you mean Maggie and I deliberately missed the beat with it. I turned a corner on the barest tangent of a sentence connecting them just to put it in a rut 3/4 through to show what those damned words have been acting like. So I guess in a way this is a success except in that I may not have made that clear enough that was what I was doing. That is what the next to the last stanza is doing there. I may have to rethink that if it is getting lost in the shuffle, but damned if I'm trying not to think about these too much.

Ha! Not a problem. I have many many many writes I put down just to get out of my head. lol Then I toss them in a drawer to play with them later. Have fun with them right now. Worry about the work when you are ready. ;)

Unfortunately not possible for me to leave it be once I see it not working right. Giving it one more shake.

Mr. Bragg

Dialing in from school. The fuel pump just went out on my car and I am waiting on a tow truck. But!... lol I didn't want you to think I am not listening. (Rudeness annoys me. lol) Give me a chance to get home please, and I will direct my attention fully to your poem ok?

Thank you hun :)

got words
but I should've got a dog
don't wake up in the night hating the dog
for the way he lies there all wrong
if a dog does wake you
it's pretty clear what he wants and what to do about it
dog is content
makes you content
easy to come back to    

(I recommend not touching this first stanza, at least for now. It is quite tight, and for me, is the stanza to gage the rest of the piece by.)    
  
words are a blister from a bad fuck
they always rub me wrong
just get worse
hide in the car
follow me to work
never smooth    
they fail me altogether with the women    

( The two sentences that seem to need reigned in a bit are   “words are a blister from a bad fuck” and  “they fail me altogether with the women”  since you want to deviate just a little, I think you can get away with leaving the second alone. However for me as a reader, and I am already thinking of ways of bringing it into the fold.  That is simply how I am experiencing it Hun. The first sentence however is too abrupt of a diversion for me. Honestly? My mind wants to say “words are a mangy fuck”. It is implying your first stanza, but not hammering someone in the head.)    
  

I got some people to watch my words
to try to figure what the fuck ails them
help with the flow
but even the bastards better with their own
no help with mine    
(“help with the flow” This line makes me thinking of “training”. I am thinking you might want to lean a teensy bit more into that thought process. I would suggest changing bastard to bitches as well. Other than that, I like this stanza.)  
  
lazy fuckers
idiomatic
stupid by dog standards  
the whole lot turned stray  
mongrels loose upon the field like wildflower
to let me know who is and who isn't master  

(I like this as well; succinct, but also descriptive. Too many times minimal loses the emotive quality of poetry in its baring down. You show a very deft hand at minimal here.)  
 
I gather those I can
like a sot who pulls up flowers for his lady
then comes in to find them all goldenrod
rough and mostly gone to seed
and well maybe she barely knows him
so it's awkward  
collecting a rogue bouquet  
for an imagined meeting
with someone who never asked    
all a bit creepy

(The only word that is really bothering me here Mr. Bragg is “creepy”.  It simply seems out of place with the rest of your piece. I don’t want to over-use the dog metaphor but at the same time “creepy does not have even the slightest implication of it for me. Something to think about Hun.)    
  
just like that  
again they're of the leash    
wasn't even talking about flowers    
  
not sure what I was going for
keep trying it anyway

(My only issue with your last bit is “trying”. I have the same issues with it as I did “creepy”.  Another issue I am having with “trying” is its lack of tangibility. I not only want to read poetry, I want to experience poetry. There is nothing to “experience” with a word like trying. See what I mean?)


I hope these thoughts help you Mr. Bragg.

Yes they do Maggie. Thanks for taking the extra time to give it a look and for giving me the detailed comments. For the most those are the spots that were nagging me still. I shall try to set them right here in just a minute.

this works really well for me mr bragg.

it flows well and stays tied in which is a hard enough task in itself without appropriate language and content. but you have them all here.

i don't read much around here that i feel does all that for me.but maybe i have'nt been lookin hard enough. i look forward to seeing more of your material.

good stuff man

Thanks man. If you read up somewhere in the comments there above this I credit this to a change in style that came about after reading poems by anna and by you. Thus it pleases me that you approve.

This line doesn't really make grammatical sense: "but even the bastards better with their own". Should it be something like "but even those bastards are better with their own words"? Also, I'd remove the poem's last two lines as they feel too neat and summatory. JMHO, of course. Otherwise it's a crisp, fun poem. S5, about the man giving a strange woman flowers, is my favourite, as it creates in its analogy an almost separate, self-sufficient narrative. Thanks for the read.

Tried to keep that colloquial tone. Wanted to go with "who are better" ... too long. Shortened it to who're but it just looks like whore to me. Can't stop laughing when I put it that way. I'll have to make it two lines. Dammit. I'll think about the last lines. I may change them, but I am not likely to remove them. I wrote those before the rest of it. Hey, at least I have a few images this time. Thanks Jack. Love your advice even when I don't take it.

haha I don't expect people to take my advice, I just expect them not to bitch-slap me for giving it.

I miss your cynical ass, Bragg. Just leaving this here in case we don't cuss each other out again in this life.

Cats are better. Actually, they aren't. Cats are assholes.

Oh yeah, good poem, blah blah, form, blah blah, use of figurative shit, blah blah.