Corona Virus ( Covid-19 )
Normal Flu Viruses
It is
with sadness
we say
goodbye
to the ones
we knew
so well
the hard fought battles
we won
and the ones
that we lose
Every Year
It is
with sadness
to see
no official
news media
recognition
no
remembrance day
of a war
that takes our loved ones
away
world wide
by the millions
but now
they are quietly silent
officially
no longer
in play
It is
with sadness
we say
goodbye
to the ones
we knew
so well
the hard fought battles
we won
and the ones
that we lose
Every Year
It is
with sadness
to see
no official
news media
recognition
no
remembrance day
of a war
that takes our loved ones
away
world wide
by the millions
but now
they are quietly silent
officially
no longer
in play
New Weekly COVID-19 Surveillance Report
COVIDView Newsletter
A weekly surveillance summary of U.S. COVID-19 activity. The report summarizes and interprets key indicators including information related to COVID-19 outpatient visits, emergency department visits, hospitalizations and deaths, as well as laboratory data.
Hospitalizations
U.S. COVID-19 lab-confirmed hospitalizations for all ages.
Mortality
Provisional Death Counts for COVID-19 and pneumonia.
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/cases-updates/cases-in-us.html
COVIDView Newsletter
A weekly surveillance summary of U.S. COVID-19 activity. The report summarizes and interprets key indicators including information related to COVID-19 outpatient visits, emergency department visits, hospitalizations and deaths, as well as laboratory data.
Hospitalizations
U.S. COVID-19 lab-confirmed hospitalizations for all ages.
Mortality
Provisional Death Counts for COVID-19 and pneumonia.
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/cases-updates/cases-in-us.html
https://youtu.be/7WnFayZ0PM8
The Richie Allen show
Interesting, worth a listen for those wanting to know more than what the party line media is selling.
Richie raises some interesting points on why the BBC is only having certain approved medical professionals on.
He is very passionate about the tryany we are falling under.
The Richie Allen show
Interesting, worth a listen for those wanting to know more than what the party line media is selling.
Richie raises some interesting points on why the BBC is only having certain approved medical professionals on.
He is very passionate about the tryany we are falling under.
Ahavati said:
It's a very beautiful letter that I wholeheartedly agree with; however, it refers more to consciousness awakening to trust as an evolution process of understanding both during and post-virus. Here's the thing, I am not afraid because I know whatever happens is meant to happen ( this includes the possibility of me contracting it ). The majority that I know do not fear the virus, they are cautious of humans, and how they act when a survival mode kicks in.
...
...
...
This quote has been shortened due to limit of 8,000 characters.
Full text on page-95.
I have posted below in italics specific quotes to which I am responding
...
...
...
So, my question stands, what does your imagination suggest to humanity ( aside from waking up consciously and learning from this ) in order to survive this without government right now. Keep in mind that trust is a slow process for many who have been hurt by those they've loved the most. If it weren't for corporate America belaying disconnects and late fees for services, and the government distributing stimulus checks, they would be losing a great deal this month.
I don't think Bret Weinstein lacked imagination as much as he was stating reality.
With respect
A
Thank you for a considerable reply
My baseline is this:
Who does one trust more for accuracy concerning what’s going on? The controlled government mass media machine (with its track-record of lies & spin), or voices that question it?
“What Bret Weinstein was saying was that NOW is not the time to go all anarchy nor pay heed to government conspiracy theories."
I’m afraid history is not on Bret’s side. Having had German in-laws who lived as teenagers & young adults in the 1930s and the war, they agonised over the rise of Hitler and spent the rest of their post-war lives in constant guilt that they did not do enough to ‘stop him’.
We face a similar time. Now is EXACTLY the right time to rigorously question the mass-media narrative and vociferously state a different perception. (Remember how mass-media works - first you control the flow of information, which leads to control of perception which in turn leads to control of behaviour).
Your comment about Denmark’s mandatory vaccines.
I picked that up hearsay from a Swedish friend, so stand better informed by you about the detail; thank you for that. But does it not cross a dangerous threshold? Do governments never break their own laws (and best intentions)?
“The mandatory vaccination [in Denmark] will only occur IF and WHEN a successful vaccine against covid-19 is developed. This is to protect the general population from the disease spreading.
I agree with it. It's no different from the polio or measles vaccines. Or a smoker whose second hand smoke can cause lung cancer. Smokers yell and scream about their rights, which I understand; however, when their rights infringe on my rights to not breathe secondhand smoke, the story changes.
I have a right to refuse something to protect myself … "
So do I, which is why I’m minimally vaxxed, haven’t drunk municipal fluoride/chlorinated water for over 25 years, don’t smoke or take drugs, not even taken an aspirin for decades, and eat only organic. In other words, I have behaved responsibly to build up a strong immune system, which I perceive as a basic right of control over my own body — and I don’t see why any tyranny should prevent me from doing so, either.
“Josh, you are someone of great intellect whom I personally admire. I don't say that to many people, so when I do, it's genuine. However, that being said, there are times I feel you are being flippant to the circumstance of others because of your own personal lifestyle.”
I’m honoured by your assessment but I’m just a steady plodder, and more of an engineer-inventor than an academic intellectual. As a back-story, in 2006/7 I felt ‘the economic system’ was going to collapse (was nearly right, given 2008). With 5 children/step-children all of whom live in big cities, I thought, jeez, when the system goes belly up how am I going to feed them, and their families?
So we gave up familiar security, kissed goodbye to pensions, moved to Portugal, bought land, went up an extremely expensive and loss-making steep learning-curve, and now grow food for two but with room for expansion.
12 years on, the leap of faith may prove to be vindicated; or not. I’m not smug. If I come over as flippant, it probably slips out from the inner tension of seeing circumstances evolving where I could say “I told you so” but at the same time not wanting these circumstances ever to happen.
But I do have an agenda, which leads …
… back to the original question about imagination. “So, my question stands, what does your imagination suggest to humanity ( aside from waking up consciously and learning from this ) in order to survive this without government right now.”
As mentioned above, I’m not suggesting ‘no government’, merely rigorous questioning both of Gov’t, and those credulous enough to believe in their every word concerning a killer virus on the loose.
And my imaginative response is simply this: the only sustainable future is a decentralised agrarian society where people look after the land and re-acquaint themselves with Nature’s bounty, and their own, for we are ‘of the same stuff’ as Nature.
A visionary government with imagination would therefore start promoting an exodus from cities to the countryside. After all, it was done the other way round from the late 1700s onwards with the Industrial Revolution. Why not the reverse? An Agrarian Revolution? Nothing is fixed; life is open.
And if you give Nature an inch (with a modicum of understanding how Nature works), she responds by giving back a mile. This is the opposite of characteristic from a Technocratic Artificial Intelligence Tyranny which if you give an inch, it takes a mile.
And it is Technocracy, not Capitalism or Communism which is destined to be the basis of a new world order, with people huddled together & controlled in cities, and with the countryside all destroyed - unless people en-masse exercise their volition to ‘go back to the land’ before it’s too late. This isn’t just a responsibility, this is a fundamental right of all humans to live in (and be enlivened by) close contact with Nature.
With respect,
Josh.
It's a very beautiful letter that I wholeheartedly agree with; however, it refers more to consciousness awakening to trust as an evolution process of understanding both during and post-virus. Here's the thing, I am not afraid because I know whatever happens is meant to happen ( this includes the possibility of me contracting it ). The majority that I know do not fear the virus, they are cautious of humans, and how they act when a survival mode kicks in.
...
...
...
This quote has been shortened due to limit of 8,000 characters.
Full text on page-95.
I have posted below in italics specific quotes to which I am responding
...
...
...
So, my question stands, what does your imagination suggest to humanity ( aside from waking up consciously and learning from this ) in order to survive this without government right now. Keep in mind that trust is a slow process for many who have been hurt by those they've loved the most. If it weren't for corporate America belaying disconnects and late fees for services, and the government distributing stimulus checks, they would be losing a great deal this month.
I don't think Bret Weinstein lacked imagination as much as he was stating reality.
With respect
A
Thank you for a considerable reply
My baseline is this:
Who does one trust more for accuracy concerning what’s going on? The controlled government mass media machine (with its track-record of lies & spin), or voices that question it?
“What Bret Weinstein was saying was that NOW is not the time to go all anarchy nor pay heed to government conspiracy theories."
I’m afraid history is not on Bret’s side. Having had German in-laws who lived as teenagers & young adults in the 1930s and the war, they agonised over the rise of Hitler and spent the rest of their post-war lives in constant guilt that they did not do enough to ‘stop him’.
We face a similar time. Now is EXACTLY the right time to rigorously question the mass-media narrative and vociferously state a different perception. (Remember how mass-media works - first you control the flow of information, which leads to control of perception which in turn leads to control of behaviour).
Your comment about Denmark’s mandatory vaccines.
I picked that up hearsay from a Swedish friend, so stand better informed by you about the detail; thank you for that. But does it not cross a dangerous threshold? Do governments never break their own laws (and best intentions)?
“The mandatory vaccination [in Denmark] will only occur IF and WHEN a successful vaccine against covid-19 is developed. This is to protect the general population from the disease spreading.
I agree with it. It's no different from the polio or measles vaccines. Or a smoker whose second hand smoke can cause lung cancer. Smokers yell and scream about their rights, which I understand; however, when their rights infringe on my rights to not breathe secondhand smoke, the story changes.
I have a right to refuse something to protect myself … "
So do I, which is why I’m minimally vaxxed, haven’t drunk municipal fluoride/chlorinated water for over 25 years, don’t smoke or take drugs, not even taken an aspirin for decades, and eat only organic. In other words, I have behaved responsibly to build up a strong immune system, which I perceive as a basic right of control over my own body — and I don’t see why any tyranny should prevent me from doing so, either.
“Josh, you are someone of great intellect whom I personally admire. I don't say that to many people, so when I do, it's genuine. However, that being said, there are times I feel you are being flippant to the circumstance of others because of your own personal lifestyle.”
I’m honoured by your assessment but I’m just a steady plodder, and more of an engineer-inventor than an academic intellectual. As a back-story, in 2006/7 I felt ‘the economic system’ was going to collapse (was nearly right, given 2008). With 5 children/step-children all of whom live in big cities, I thought, jeez, when the system goes belly up how am I going to feed them, and their families?
So we gave up familiar security, kissed goodbye to pensions, moved to Portugal, bought land, went up an extremely expensive and loss-making steep learning-curve, and now grow food for two but with room for expansion.
12 years on, the leap of faith may prove to be vindicated; or not. I’m not smug. If I come over as flippant, it probably slips out from the inner tension of seeing circumstances evolving where I could say “I told you so” but at the same time not wanting these circumstances ever to happen.
But I do have an agenda, which leads …
… back to the original question about imagination. “So, my question stands, what does your imagination suggest to humanity ( aside from waking up consciously and learning from this ) in order to survive this without government right now.”
As mentioned above, I’m not suggesting ‘no government’, merely rigorous questioning both of Gov’t, and those credulous enough to believe in their every word concerning a killer virus on the loose.
And my imaginative response is simply this: the only sustainable future is a decentralised agrarian society where people look after the land and re-acquaint themselves with Nature’s bounty, and their own, for we are ‘of the same stuff’ as Nature.
A visionary government with imagination would therefore start promoting an exodus from cities to the countryside. After all, it was done the other way round from the late 1700s onwards with the Industrial Revolution. Why not the reverse? An Agrarian Revolution? Nothing is fixed; life is open.
And if you give Nature an inch (with a modicum of understanding how Nature works), she responds by giving back a mile. This is the opposite of characteristic from a Technocratic Artificial Intelligence Tyranny which if you give an inch, it takes a mile.
And it is Technocracy, not Capitalism or Communism which is destined to be the basis of a new world order, with people huddled together & controlled in cities, and with the countryside all destroyed - unless people en-masse exercise their volition to ‘go back to the land’ before it’s too late. This isn’t just a responsibility, this is a fundamental right of all humans to live in (and be enlivened by) close contact with Nature.
With respect,
Josh.
Josh said:
Thank you for a considerable reply
My baseline is this:
Who does one trust more for accuracy concerning what’s going on? The controlled government mass media machine (with its track-record of lies & spin), or voices that question it?
“What Bret Weinstein was saying was that NOW is not the time to go all anarchy nor pay heed to government conspiracy theories."
I’m afraid history is not on Bret’s side. Having had German in-laws who lived as teenagers & young adults in the 1930s and the war, they agonised over the rise of Hitler and spent the rest of their post-war lives in constant guilt that they did not do enough to ‘stop him’.
We face a similar time. Now is EXACTLY the right time to rigorously question the mass-media narrative and vociferously state a different perception. (Remember how mass-media works - first you control the flow of information, which leads to control of perception which in turn leads to control of behaviour).
Your comment about Denmark’s mandatory vaccines.
I picked that up hearsay from a Swedish friend, so stand better informed by you about the detail; thank you for that. But does it not cross a dangerous threshold? Do governments never break their own laws (and best intentions)?
“The mandatory vaccination [in Denmark] will only occur IF and WHEN a successful vaccine against covid-19 is developed. This is to protect the general population from the disease spreading.
I agree with it. It's no different from the polio or measles vaccines. Or a smoker whose second hand smoke can cause lung cancer. Smokers yell and scream about their rights, which I understand; however, when their rights infringe on my rights to not breathe secondhand smoke, the story changes.
I have a right to refuse something to protect myself … "
So do I, which is why I’m minimally vaxxed, haven’t drunk municipal fluoride/chlorinated water for over 25 years, don’t smoke or take drugs, not even taken an aspirin for decades, and eat only organic. In other words, I have behaved responsibly to build up a strong immune system, which I perceive as a basic right of control over my own body — and I don’t see why any tyranny should prevent me from doing so, either.
“Josh, you are someone of great intellect whom I personally admire. I don't say that to many people, so when I do, it's genuine. However, that being said, there are times I feel you are being flippant to the circumstance of others because of your own personal lifestyle.”
I’m honoured by your assessment but I’m just a steady plodder, and more of an engineer-inventor than an academic intellectual. As a back-story, in 2006/7 I felt ‘the economic system’ was going to collapse (was nearly right, given 2008). With 5 children/step-children all of whom live in big cities, I thought, jeez, when the system goes belly up how am I going to feed them, and their families?
So we gave up familiar security, kissed goodbye to pensions, moved to Portugal, bought land, went up an extremely expensive and loss-making steep learning-curve, and now grow food for two but with room for expansion.
12 years on, the leap of faith may prove to be vindicated; or not. I’m not smug. If I come over as flippant, it probably slips out from the inner tension of seeing circumstances evolving where I could say “I told you so” but at the same time not wanting these circumstances ever to happen.
But I do have an agenda, which leads …
… back to the original question about imagination. “So, my question stands, what does your imagination suggest to humanity ( aside from waking up consciously and learning from this ) in order to survive this without government right now.”
As mentioned above, I’m not suggesting ‘no government’, merely rigorous questioning both of Gov’t, and those credulous enough to believe in their every word concerning a killer virus on the loose.
And my imaginative response is simply this: the only sustainable future is a decentralised agrarian society where people look after the land and re-acquaint themselves with Nature’s bounty, and their own, for we are ‘of the same stuff’ as Nature.
A visionary government with imagination would therefore start promoting an exodus from cities to the countryside. After all, it was done the other way round from the late 1700s onwards with the Industrial Revolution. Why not the reverse? An Agrarian Revolution? Nothing is fixed; life is open.
And if you give Nature an inch (with a modicum of understanding how Nature works), she responds by giving back a mile. This is the opposite of characteristic from a Technocratic Artificial Intelligence Tyranny which if you give an inch, it takes a mile.
And it is Technocracy, not Capitalism or Communism which is destined to be the basis of a new world order, with people huddled together & controlled in cities, and with the countryside all destroyed - unless people en-masse exercise their volition to ‘go back to the land’ before it’s too late. This isn’t just a responsibility, this is a fundamental right of all humans to live in (and be enlivened by) close contact with Nature.
With respect,
Josh.
Well said, Sir
Imagine the possibilities if the world learned self sufficientcy again.
They may say I'm a dreamer, but
I'm not the only one
Stay safe mate
Thank you for a considerable reply
My baseline is this:
Who does one trust more for accuracy concerning what’s going on? The controlled government mass media machine (with its track-record of lies & spin), or voices that question it?
“What Bret Weinstein was saying was that NOW is not the time to go all anarchy nor pay heed to government conspiracy theories."
I’m afraid history is not on Bret’s side. Having had German in-laws who lived as teenagers & young adults in the 1930s and the war, they agonised over the rise of Hitler and spent the rest of their post-war lives in constant guilt that they did not do enough to ‘stop him’.
We face a similar time. Now is EXACTLY the right time to rigorously question the mass-media narrative and vociferously state a different perception. (Remember how mass-media works - first you control the flow of information, which leads to control of perception which in turn leads to control of behaviour).
Your comment about Denmark’s mandatory vaccines.
I picked that up hearsay from a Swedish friend, so stand better informed by you about the detail; thank you for that. But does it not cross a dangerous threshold? Do governments never break their own laws (and best intentions)?
“The mandatory vaccination [in Denmark] will only occur IF and WHEN a successful vaccine against covid-19 is developed. This is to protect the general population from the disease spreading.
I agree with it. It's no different from the polio or measles vaccines. Or a smoker whose second hand smoke can cause lung cancer. Smokers yell and scream about their rights, which I understand; however, when their rights infringe on my rights to not breathe secondhand smoke, the story changes.
I have a right to refuse something to protect myself … "
So do I, which is why I’m minimally vaxxed, haven’t drunk municipal fluoride/chlorinated water for over 25 years, don’t smoke or take drugs, not even taken an aspirin for decades, and eat only organic. In other words, I have behaved responsibly to build up a strong immune system, which I perceive as a basic right of control over my own body — and I don’t see why any tyranny should prevent me from doing so, either.
“Josh, you are someone of great intellect whom I personally admire. I don't say that to many people, so when I do, it's genuine. However, that being said, there are times I feel you are being flippant to the circumstance of others because of your own personal lifestyle.”
I’m honoured by your assessment but I’m just a steady plodder, and more of an engineer-inventor than an academic intellectual. As a back-story, in 2006/7 I felt ‘the economic system’ was going to collapse (was nearly right, given 2008). With 5 children/step-children all of whom live in big cities, I thought, jeez, when the system goes belly up how am I going to feed them, and their families?
So we gave up familiar security, kissed goodbye to pensions, moved to Portugal, bought land, went up an extremely expensive and loss-making steep learning-curve, and now grow food for two but with room for expansion.
12 years on, the leap of faith may prove to be vindicated; or not. I’m not smug. If I come over as flippant, it probably slips out from the inner tension of seeing circumstances evolving where I could say “I told you so” but at the same time not wanting these circumstances ever to happen.
But I do have an agenda, which leads …
… back to the original question about imagination. “So, my question stands, what does your imagination suggest to humanity ( aside from waking up consciously and learning from this ) in order to survive this without government right now.”
As mentioned above, I’m not suggesting ‘no government’, merely rigorous questioning both of Gov’t, and those credulous enough to believe in their every word concerning a killer virus on the loose.
And my imaginative response is simply this: the only sustainable future is a decentralised agrarian society where people look after the land and re-acquaint themselves with Nature’s bounty, and their own, for we are ‘of the same stuff’ as Nature.
A visionary government with imagination would therefore start promoting an exodus from cities to the countryside. After all, it was done the other way round from the late 1700s onwards with the Industrial Revolution. Why not the reverse? An Agrarian Revolution? Nothing is fixed; life is open.
And if you give Nature an inch (with a modicum of understanding how Nature works), she responds by giving back a mile. This is the opposite of characteristic from a Technocratic Artificial Intelligence Tyranny which if you give an inch, it takes a mile.
And it is Technocracy, not Capitalism or Communism which is destined to be the basis of a new world order, with people huddled together & controlled in cities, and with the countryside all destroyed - unless people en-masse exercise their volition to ‘go back to the land’ before it’s too late. This isn’t just a responsibility, this is a fundamental right of all humans to live in (and be enlivened by) close contact with Nature.
With respect,
Josh.
Well said, Sir
Imagine the possibilities if the world learned self sufficientcy again.
They may say I'm a dreamer, but
I'm not the only one
Stay safe mate
Carpe_Noctem said:
Well said, Sir
Imagine the possibilities if the world learned self sufficientcy again.
They may say I'm a dreamer, but
I'm not the only one
Stay safe mate
Carpe, with respect, there are too many people & too many urban catchments on this planet for many of us to be totally self-sufficient like Josh. Josh may find that he is able to help some of his neighbours/local community with food, should it become scarce, if the shit hits the fan there. The trouble is, we do rely on supermarkets for our produce when we live in built-up areas. How are we gonna learn self-sufficiency? You just sprout this stuff without providing answers. Frankly, I find that annoying.
Well said, Sir
Imagine the possibilities if the world learned self sufficientcy again.
They may say I'm a dreamer, but
I'm not the only one
Stay safe mate
Carpe, with respect, there are too many people & too many urban catchments on this planet for many of us to be totally self-sufficient like Josh. Josh may find that he is able to help some of his neighbours/local community with food, should it become scarce, if the shit hits the fan there. The trouble is, we do rely on supermarkets for our produce when we live in built-up areas. How are we gonna learn self-sufficiency? You just sprout this stuff without providing answers. Frankly, I find that annoying.
Billy_Snagg said: Carpe, with respect, there are too many people & too many urban catchments on this planet for many of us to be totally self-sufficient like Josh. Josh may find that he is able to help some of his neighbours/local community with food, should it become scarce, if the shit hits the fan there. The trouble is, we do rely on supermarkets for our produce when we live in built-up areas. How are we gonna learn self-sufficiency? You just sprout this stuff without providing answers. Frankly, I find that annoying.
Billy if the governments cared there would be more community gardens and allotments.
Most urban people can get raised beds and soil and grow things.
Even balconies can grow a few things.
Now Billy if people started doing this as a community, surplus would be shared /traded amongst neighbours, perhaps the community would produce enough to trade with neighbouring communities.
These are but simple solutions Billy but they are a start.
Carpe_Noctem said:
Billy if the governments cared there would be more community gardens and allotments.
Most urban people can get raised beds and soil and grow things.
Even balconies can grow a few things.
Now Billy if people started doing this as a community, surplus would be shared /traded amongst neighbours, perhaps the community would produce enough to trade with neighbouring communities.
These are but simple solutions Billy but they are a start.
I want what you're smokin' Carpe.
However, there are lessons that could be learned about how to be more self-sufficient. Maybe the government can show us?
Billy if the governments cared there would be more community gardens and allotments.
Most urban people can get raised beds and soil and grow things.
Even balconies can grow a few things.
Now Billy if people started doing this as a community, surplus would be shared /traded amongst neighbours, perhaps the community would produce enough to trade with neighbouring communities.
These are but simple solutions Billy but they are a start.
I want what you're smokin' Carpe.
However, there are lessons that could be learned about how to be more self-sufficient. Maybe the government can show us?
This may be in two posts due to length:
Josh said:
Thank you for a considerable reply
My baseline is this:
Who does one trust more for accuracy concerning what’s going on? The controlled government mass media machine (with its track-record of lies & spin), or voices that question it?
I trust that this virus is real and killing people. I trust the people on the frontline ( doctors, nurses, etc. ), I trust scientific findings and sources, and, I don't always think that mass media is lying nor government controlled. If they were government controlled they wouldn't question the commander in chief, nor call him out for wrongdoings. We would be China if our media was mass-controlled.
“What Bret Weinstein was saying was that NOW is not the time to go all anarchy nor pay heed to government conspiracy theories."
I’m afraid history is not on Bret’s side. Having had German in-laws who lived as teenagers & young adults in the 1930s and the war, they agonised over the rise of Hitler and spent the rest of their post-war lives in constant guilt that they did not do enough to ‘stop him’.
Josh, comparing a pandemic to the holocaust isn't even applicable, inho. I had ancestors perish during that blight on history. My ancestral country of Croatia was practically wiped out during WWII.
Covid-19 is the enemy here, and every country in the world is fighting it.
It's apples and oranges, imho.
We face a similar time. Now is EXACTLY the right time to rigorously question the mass-media narrative and vociferously state a different perception. (Remember how mass-media works - first you control the flow of information, which leads to control of perception which in turn leads to control of behaviour).
This is in no way a similar time, Josh. Every measure being put in place is to flatten the curve. We're just going to have to wait and see where this all leads rather than continually butting heads.
Your comment about Denmark’s mandatory vaccines.
I picked that up hearsay from a Swedish friend, so stand better informed by you about the detail; thank you for that. But does it not cross a dangerous threshold? Do governments never break their own laws (and best intentions)?
No; I don't believe it crosses a dangerous threshold. Here in America your children must be immunized to go to school. If you refuse, they don't go to school, but must be educated nonetheless. That is both protecting other children from potential disease as well as protecting your own by ensuring they receive an education.
I am not the biggest fan of government regardless of what you may think. It grates my nerves that a massive group of elected officials can't even balance a budget. So, yes; I do believe they break their own laws too. But, that doesn't give me a right to break a law which was enacted to protect others from irresponsible actions. It doesn't give me a right to break the law and murder someone, steal from someone, etc.
Hopefully I outgrew the "Well he did it so I'm doing it" mentality in elementary school, though, willingly admit to falling back on it when I witness injustice.
“The mandatory vaccination [in Denmark] will only occur IF and WHEN a successful vaccine against covid-19 is developed. This is to protect the general population from the disease spreading. I agree with it. It's no different from the polio or measles vaccines. Or a smoker whose second hand smoke can cause lung cancer. Smokers yell and scream about their rights, which I understand; however, when their rights infringe on my rights to not breathe secondhand smoke, the story changes.
I have a right to refuse something to protect myself … "
So do I, which is why I’m minimally vaxxed, haven’t drunk municipal fluoride/chlorinated water for over 25 years, don’t smoke or take drugs, not even taken an aspirin for decades, and eat only organic. In other words, I have behaved responsibly to build up a strong immune system, which I perceive as a basic right of control over my own body — and I don’t see why any tyranny should prevent me from doing so, either.
Who's trying to prevent you from living that way? There is nothing in any bill that I've read, which would require a person give up anything they currently have. They are simply trying to flatten the curve and protect their citizens. At least you are minimally vaxxed, I imagine against polio and measles. I know if you travel, vaccinations are required in certain countries ( or, they were when I travelled ). I didn't and don't feel vaccinations infringe upon my quality of living nor what I eat, drink, or how I live.
I’m honoured by your assessment but I’m just a steady plodder, and more of an engineer-inventor than an academic intellectual. As a back-story, in 2006/7 I felt ‘the economic system’ was going to collapse (was nearly right, given 2008). With 5 children/step-children all of whom live in big cities, I thought, jeez, when the system goes belly up how am I going to feed them, and their families?
So we gave up familiar security, kissed goodbye to pensions, moved to Portugal, bought land, went up an extremely expensive and loss-making steep learning-curve, and now grow food for two but with room for expansion.
12 years on, the leap of faith may prove to be vindicated; or not.
You were blessed to be in that position to relocate. So was I when I quit a position on faith a few years back without another job. It paid off; however, my point in my previous post is that not everyone is in the position that we are. Not everyone has the money to purchase land, or to leave the country. Or, to even buy a loaf of bread.
And it's not necessarily their fault either. There are genuine victims of circumstance.
part II below
Josh said:
Thank you for a considerable reply
My baseline is this:
Who does one trust more for accuracy concerning what’s going on? The controlled government mass media machine (with its track-record of lies & spin), or voices that question it?
I trust that this virus is real and killing people. I trust the people on the frontline ( doctors, nurses, etc. ), I trust scientific findings and sources, and, I don't always think that mass media is lying nor government controlled. If they were government controlled they wouldn't question the commander in chief, nor call him out for wrongdoings. We would be China if our media was mass-controlled.
“What Bret Weinstein was saying was that NOW is not the time to go all anarchy nor pay heed to government conspiracy theories."
I’m afraid history is not on Bret’s side. Having had German in-laws who lived as teenagers & young adults in the 1930s and the war, they agonised over the rise of Hitler and spent the rest of their post-war lives in constant guilt that they did not do enough to ‘stop him’.
Josh, comparing a pandemic to the holocaust isn't even applicable, inho. I had ancestors perish during that blight on history. My ancestral country of Croatia was practically wiped out during WWII.
Covid-19 is the enemy here, and every country in the world is fighting it.
It's apples and oranges, imho.
We face a similar time. Now is EXACTLY the right time to rigorously question the mass-media narrative and vociferously state a different perception. (Remember how mass-media works - first you control the flow of information, which leads to control of perception which in turn leads to control of behaviour).
This is in no way a similar time, Josh. Every measure being put in place is to flatten the curve. We're just going to have to wait and see where this all leads rather than continually butting heads.
Your comment about Denmark’s mandatory vaccines.
I picked that up hearsay from a Swedish friend, so stand better informed by you about the detail; thank you for that. But does it not cross a dangerous threshold? Do governments never break their own laws (and best intentions)?
No; I don't believe it crosses a dangerous threshold. Here in America your children must be immunized to go to school. If you refuse, they don't go to school, but must be educated nonetheless. That is both protecting other children from potential disease as well as protecting your own by ensuring they receive an education.
I am not the biggest fan of government regardless of what you may think. It grates my nerves that a massive group of elected officials can't even balance a budget. So, yes; I do believe they break their own laws too. But, that doesn't give me a right to break a law which was enacted to protect others from irresponsible actions. It doesn't give me a right to break the law and murder someone, steal from someone, etc.
Hopefully I outgrew the "Well he did it so I'm doing it" mentality in elementary school, though, willingly admit to falling back on it when I witness injustice.
“The mandatory vaccination [in Denmark] will only occur IF and WHEN a successful vaccine against covid-19 is developed. This is to protect the general population from the disease spreading. I agree with it. It's no different from the polio or measles vaccines. Or a smoker whose second hand smoke can cause lung cancer. Smokers yell and scream about their rights, which I understand; however, when their rights infringe on my rights to not breathe secondhand smoke, the story changes.
I have a right to refuse something to protect myself … "
So do I, which is why I’m minimally vaxxed, haven’t drunk municipal fluoride/chlorinated water for over 25 years, don’t smoke or take drugs, not even taken an aspirin for decades, and eat only organic. In other words, I have behaved responsibly to build up a strong immune system, which I perceive as a basic right of control over my own body — and I don’t see why any tyranny should prevent me from doing so, either.
Who's trying to prevent you from living that way? There is nothing in any bill that I've read, which would require a person give up anything they currently have. They are simply trying to flatten the curve and protect their citizens. At least you are minimally vaxxed, I imagine against polio and measles. I know if you travel, vaccinations are required in certain countries ( or, they were when I travelled ). I didn't and don't feel vaccinations infringe upon my quality of living nor what I eat, drink, or how I live.
I’m honoured by your assessment but I’m just a steady plodder, and more of an engineer-inventor than an academic intellectual. As a back-story, in 2006/7 I felt ‘the economic system’ was going to collapse (was nearly right, given 2008). With 5 children/step-children all of whom live in big cities, I thought, jeez, when the system goes belly up how am I going to feed them, and their families?
So we gave up familiar security, kissed goodbye to pensions, moved to Portugal, bought land, went up an extremely expensive and loss-making steep learning-curve, and now grow food for two but with room for expansion.
12 years on, the leap of faith may prove to be vindicated; or not.
You were blessed to be in that position to relocate. So was I when I quit a position on faith a few years back without another job. It paid off; however, my point in my previous post is that not everyone is in the position that we are. Not everyone has the money to purchase land, or to leave the country. Or, to even buy a loaf of bread.
And it's not necessarily their fault either. There are genuine victims of circumstance.
part II below
I’m not smug. If I come over as flippant, it probably slips out from the inner tension of seeing circumstances evolving where I could say “I told you so” but at the same time not wanting these circumstances ever to happen.
But I do have an agenda, which leads… back to the original question about imagination. “So, my question stands, what does your imagination suggest to humanity ( aside from waking up consciously and learning from this ) in order to survive this without government right now.”
As mentioned above, I’m not suggesting ‘no government’, merely rigorous questioning both of Gov’t, and those credulous enough to believe in their every word concerning a killer virus on the loose.
And my imaginative response is simply this: the only sustainable future is a decentralised agrarian society where people look after the land and re-acquaint themselves with Nature’s bounty, and their own, for we are ‘of the same stuff’ as Nature.
A visionary government with imagination would therefore start promoting an exodus from cities to the countryside. After all, it was done the other way round from the late 1700s onwards with the Industrial Revolution. Why not the reverse? An Agrarian Revolution? Nothing is fixed; life is open.
And if you give Nature an inch (with a modicum of understanding how Nature works), she responds by giving back a mile. This is the opposite of characteristic from a Technocratic Artificial Intelligence Tyranny which if you give an inch, it takes a mile.
And it is Technocracy, not Capitalism or Communism which is destined to be the basis of a new world order, with people huddled together & controlled in cities, and with the countryside all destroyed - unless people en-masse exercise their volition to ‘go back to the land’ before it’s too late. This isn’t just a responsibility, this is a fundamental right of all humans to live in (and be enlivened by) close contact with Nature.
With respect,
Josh.
Then there are the need for hospitals and power companies and phone companies and textile and electronic and so forth. Then progress said "let there be cities and skyscrapers to house them in" so they can be centralized to the surrounding villages.
Not everyone enjoys the countryside, Josh. Some actually love city life, and if that's what they enjoy, then they should be able to live as such. I believe progression and history can coexist peacefully. And I'm glad to hear you are referring not to a lack of government, but, as Bret Weinstein said, a functioning government.
I personally think our government has gotten too big, but that's me not being a politician and fully understanding the functioning aspect of government from the inside.
At any rate, I think we need to agree that this virus is real, it is killing people, all things should be questioned ( including people who question ), and as for the rest, perhaps agree to disagree.
Respect given and received.
But I do have an agenda, which leads… back to the original question about imagination. “So, my question stands, what does your imagination suggest to humanity ( aside from waking up consciously and learning from this ) in order to survive this without government right now.”
As mentioned above, I’m not suggesting ‘no government’, merely rigorous questioning both of Gov’t, and those credulous enough to believe in their every word concerning a killer virus on the loose.
And my imaginative response is simply this: the only sustainable future is a decentralised agrarian society where people look after the land and re-acquaint themselves with Nature’s bounty, and their own, for we are ‘of the same stuff’ as Nature.
A visionary government with imagination would therefore start promoting an exodus from cities to the countryside. After all, it was done the other way round from the late 1700s onwards with the Industrial Revolution. Why not the reverse? An Agrarian Revolution? Nothing is fixed; life is open.
And if you give Nature an inch (with a modicum of understanding how Nature works), she responds by giving back a mile. This is the opposite of characteristic from a Technocratic Artificial Intelligence Tyranny which if you give an inch, it takes a mile.
And it is Technocracy, not Capitalism or Communism which is destined to be the basis of a new world order, with people huddled together & controlled in cities, and with the countryside all destroyed - unless people en-masse exercise their volition to ‘go back to the land’ before it’s too late. This isn’t just a responsibility, this is a fundamental right of all humans to live in (and be enlivened by) close contact with Nature.
With respect,
Josh.
Then there are the need for hospitals and power companies and phone companies and textile and electronic and so forth. Then progress said "let there be cities and skyscrapers to house them in" so they can be centralized to the surrounding villages.
Not everyone enjoys the countryside, Josh. Some actually love city life, and if that's what they enjoy, then they should be able to live as such. I believe progression and history can coexist peacefully. And I'm glad to hear you are referring not to a lack of government, but, as Bret Weinstein said, a functioning government.
I personally think our government has gotten too big, but that's me not being a politician and fully understanding the functioning aspect of government from the inside.
At any rate, I think we need to agree that this virus is real, it is killing people, all things should be questioned ( including people who question ), and as for the rest, perhaps agree to disagree.
Respect given and received.
